Misunderestimated

Wednesday, July 13, 2005

Chris is too conservative once again

With his estimates I mean. According to NY Times reporting this morning, "an unexpected leap in tax revenue is about to shrink the federal budget deficit this year, by nearly $100 billion." So much for possibly as high as 90 billion. As the article notes further,

"Most of the increase in individual tax receipts appears to have come from higher stock market gains and the business income of relatively wealthy taxpayers. The biggest jump was not from taxes withheld from salaries but from quarterly payments on investment gains and business earnings, which were up 20 percent this year. That was similar, though much smaller than a sharp rise in tax revenue during the stock market boom of the late 1990's, which was followed by plunges in revenue when the market bubble burst." (The full article is available here)

Now, for all the Democrats that cite President Clinton for balancing the budget, take note. According to Dick Morris, Clinton's chief political advisor at the time (eg Clinton's Rove -- "The Architect" -- for his 1996 success), the budget was balanced not because Clinton reduced spending (in most areas he did the opposite), but because of the huge increases in tax revenue from the stock market's boom. With more tax revenue, the government could afford to spend what it had been all along. Add to that a Republican-controlled House at the time which refused to approve the drastic increases in spending that Clinton wanted (which would have unbalanced the budget), and a balanced budget took form.

Then, when the stock bubble burst, the increased tax revenue that the bubble brought suddenly disappeared, returning the government to an unbalanced state -- beginning with the recession started just before Bush took office.

There are a few things that should be noted there. First, the Clinton administration's "balanced budget" was not the result of "Clintonomics." Clinton wanted to spend more, but, when Republicans retook the House in 1994, they would not let him. Their constraints, tied to a stock market boom and the tax revenues from it, were what led the budget to be balanced at all. As Wikipedia even notes, "The Republican takeover of Congress in 1994 led to a push for a balanced budget, forcing President Clinton to agree to reducing the deficit. Major economic growth and GOP led spending controls such as Welfare Reform allowed for a balanced budget (when Social Security surplus was counted as revenue) by early in Clinton's second term in 1997 - considerably earlier than what Clinton's own projections for this had indicated."

Second, the surplus only came in Clinton's SECOND term, even though the economy began heating up late into George H.W. Bush's term (too late to help him in the election), and booming early into Clinton's first term. Even with a booming economy, Clinton did not balance the budget until the beginning of his second term in office -- when Republicans in the House rejected 4 budgets in which Clinton proposed huge spending increases and only affirmed the fifth budget that Clinton sent to Congress which eliminated much of the increased spending the Clinton proposed.

Third, unlike the very end of George H.W. Bush's Presidency when the economy began to really heat up, at the very end of Clinton's Presidency the economy began to really sour. When George W. Bush came to office, it was the beginning stage of a recession. Despite this, in the past election, Democrats hammered Bush for not balancing the budget in his first term -- which Clinton could not manage to do in his first term even as the economy began to boom by the time he took office in 1993!

Fourth, the increase in tax revenues under the Clinton administration were based on a bubble. When stock prices were inflated, more money came in from capital gains tax. But those revenues could not be sustained. In essence, they were based off a huge structural gap that inevitably had to burst. Not only were they unstable, then, but they were unnatural and not based on actual economic performance. The fact was that investors though stocks were worth more than they really were worth and that they thought the economy was in better shape than it really was -- the definition of a bubble, after all, is when the price of stock diverges significantly from its actual value. Clinton's increased tax revenues were ultimately based, then, more on the faulty judgments of economic agents rather than sound economic theory.

Fifth, part of the bubble was caused by CEO's like those at Enron and Worldcom cooking their books to make it look like their companies (and therefore their stocks) were worth more than they really were. The fact that such CEO's were not as regulated as they should have been during Clinton's economic boom, and held more accountable, may have caused tax revenues to increase in the short term under Clinton, but, when the bubble burst, it also made the damage all the worse. While most liberals I've seen have blamed Bush for the actions of the CEO's (and draw all sorts of connections), the fact is that most, if not all, of the crimes they committed were during the stock market boom UNDER CLINTON.

Sixth, Clinton's success with reducing deficits, along with the shrinking deficit now under Bush, reflect victories of conservative economic theory that the budget can be balanced through increased economic activity rather than through tax hikes that reduce that hamper that activity. There's a reason why the U.S. is outperforming the E.U. these days (bringing the Euro back down and making many investors clammer back for dollars): the Europeans have the huge handicap of excessive, excessive taxes that make the competition for economic performance a no brainer. The E.U. is working with one hand tied behind its back, and the best part is that it is E.U. nations themselves, and not any outside force, that tied it. The way to reduce deficits is in large part to promote economic growth, which will naturally bring in more revenues with the tax rate remaining constant, rather than increase taxes and decrease economic activity. Yes, it sounds supply side. But there's a reason Columbia's Professor Mundell received a Nobel Prize for his theory, even if it -- like all economic theories -- has its fair share of problems.

Seventh, in probably the only point that staunch Democrats will agree on, Congressional restraint is necessary to balancing the budget too. Republicans in Congress must push the administration to reduce what has been at times reckless spending. If Congress defeated 4 of 5 budgets Clinton proposed in one year alone because of reckless spending, Congress certainly can be stricter with Bush about his own reckless spending in his budgets. That's its job, regardless of the party that controls it. And, in the end, Bush himself will look a lot better after his second term if part of his legacy is restoring a balanced budget along with economic growth after the recession, much like Clinton's legacy looks more rosy to people who lionize him for balancing the budget -- even though he fought all he could for budgets that would, had they have passed Congress, results in further deficits rather than fiscal sanity.

Finally, Republicans should recognize that, despite Democratic rhetoric, Democrats are not really interested in balancing the budget at all. If they ever retake both the White House and Congress together (G-d forbid!), you can be sure they will spend the same amount which they've always wanted to spend. After all, at the same time as Democrats blast Bush for deficits, they have attacked him for not spending enough on education (even though he increased the budget of the Department of Education by 58% in his first four years), healthcare (universal health care, right?), et al. If the Republican Party is really the party of fiscal responsibility, it must act the part now while it has the reigns and prove that, when a Party has power, it does not have to just spend more and more pork. Republicans in Congress should make Bush's budget a bit more Kosher and eliminate the pork. That, combined with the robust but more stable economic performance that has taken root over the past two years, would be a great financial legacy for this Pax Romana of Republican dominance and will set the legacy of the Republican Party for years to come.

19 Comments:

  • Ok, I definitely didn't post this at 4:56am. More like 9:00am. For the record.

    By Blogger Dennis, at 9:00 AM  

  • Boy am I thrilled we found some more money so that we can continue with our decade-long over-bloated spending spree!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:24 AM  

  • And about those unemployment numbers? Not too shabby.

    By Blogger Adam, at 11:07 AM  

  • I appreciate your saying that I am not foolish. Occasionally I like to think that I am not. Thank you.

    As you said, this war is not the only reason why spending is so high. It is merely a big piece in the puzzle. However, I do not agree with fighting wars to bolster the strength of the UN by "enforcing UN resolutions." That's even aside from the fact that the administration deliberately lied about those weapons (has someone found them yet?) So therefore, I don't think this increase in military spending is necessary because we should not be fighting in the first place.

    Even ignoring the military budget, I guarantee you that there will be no significant spending cuts anywhere. I have been saying over and over again that it is a complete myth that Bush is a conservative (socialist is a more descriptive term in my book)- and I still stand by that view.

    But let me be clear: nothing will make me happier than being proven wrong. I will celebrate when Bush abolishes a few departments, the income tax, and a few other things I can't think of at the moment.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:17 AM  

  • "However, I do not agree with fighting wars to bolster the strength of the UN by 'enforcing UN resolutions.'"

    We went to war to bolder the UN? Really now. That's the first time I've ever heard that...

    "That's even aside from the fact that the administration deliberately lied about those weapons (has someone found them yet?)"

    Ok, two things.

    First of all, just because the administration was wrong about Saddam's WMD does not mean the administration "deliberately lied." There's a huge difference. Whether he lied depends on what he was told by his Intelligence Agencies compared to what he said.

    Second, I'd suggest you read in full the "Report of the Select Committee on Intelligence on the U.S. Intelligence Community’s Prewar Intelligence Assessments on Iraq", or at least its introduction and description of the October 2002 National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) entitled "Iraq ’s Continuing Programs for Weapons of Mass Destruction", before you assert that the President deliberately lied at all. The bipartisan report details what The President & Vice President were told and when by Intelligence Agencies, and consistently critizes overstatements made by the Intelligence Community that were made to seem more certain than they really were.

    Oh, and in case you believe that there was pressure on analysts to do that, the Report covers that too. As it notes, "no analyst questioned by the Committee stated that the questions were unreasonable, or that they were encouraged by the questioningto alter their conclusions." The full report is available here: http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/iraq.html . Too bad most Democrats either can't read or deliberately choose to ignore the Senate Report on this issue because they prefer to assert Bush lie. From what the Report notes the intelligence agencies communicated to the President, it is abundantly clear that he told the American public what the Intelligence Community was telling him.

    "So therefore, I don't think this increase in military spending is necessary because we should not be fighting in the first place."

    Are you saying we should immediately leave? Or that we shouldn't have gone to war. If the latter, well, we already have and that can't be changed. Our troops are on the ground, and not funding them because you don't think we should have gone to war would be ludicrous (punushing soldiers for what you view as a bad Presidential decision). I assume you mean the former then? But that opens a whole other can of worms. Yummy.

    By Blogger Dennis, at 2:34 PM  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger chriskulawik, at 8:23 PM  

  • (bahhhh I say to the lack of spell check!)

    Fantastic post!


    and to the comments on my last post; the basic principles of Reaganomics clearly work - despite the mismanagement of Congress and the President and all the needless domestic spending.

    (I'll do my Snoopy dance when the IRS building becomes a museum - a privately funded - museum).

    By Blogger chriskulawik, at 8:34 PM  

  • dennis,

    As to your first comment, this has been readily documented though probably not on Fox News where you spend most of your time. I remember a class I took at Columbia when the professor said to the class, "I can't believe the UN approved... was anyone actually NOT shocked?" (I must embarassingly state that I don't remember exactly what he was referring to but it had something to do with approving of Bush going to Iraq. I remember the day and where I sat in the class, but I don't remember EXACTLY what the prof was referring to). While I did not respond, I snickered to myself because I knew the war was about strengthening the UN from long ago. The same holds now. The mistake people make in economics, but in politics as well, is looking at the short-run, or specifically in the case of economics, looking at the short-run and only looking at one group of people. The supposed "unilateral" action by Bush is a complete sham and in the long-run the UN will be much better off.

    The administration deliberately lied. Again, this is not documented by Sean Hannity, or Rush Limbaugh. If the evidence that these people wanted to go to Iraq years ago isn't enough, then the fact that they have been proven wrong in what they said should bolster that view. If the administration wants to state that there are weapons in Iraq, that is perfectly fine. But if it turns out that they are wrong, they have clearly lied, and deliberately (if you read the next three sentences, you will know why I say deliberately). If they did not want to be accused of lying, then they would not make absurd accusations without verifying their validity. I also don't care what political party this had to do with so your comments about Democrats mean nothing to me. If you claimed there were weapons when there were PLENTY of people (yes, those damn liberals included, but constitutional conservatives as well) saying the opposite, then you lied deliberately. Plain and simple. Of course if the UN is factored into the equation, you would know what the purpose was.

    We should not have gone to war in the first place. We should get our troops and money out of Iraq not tomorrow, but right this second. Sacrificing more American lives and more American money for the President's international escapades is not a worthy venture.

    chriskulawik,

    Your comment about Reagonomics makes no sense. Reagonomics is supply side economics. To say that it works, but to subtract the spending aspect is contradictory. Supply side economics is cutting taxes (good) but leaving the spending aspect as is, or making it worse (bad). I'm glad you want the IRS building to be a museum, I'm wondering why you didn't say the same for the Fed. If you say that you honestly don't know enough about the economics of the Fed, I will be able to respect your view. Otherwise, please state what you think.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:34 PM  

  • Anon,

    Your incompetence amazes me. I linked you to a bipartisan Congressional Report on the Iraqi Intelligence which clearly describes, in great detail, WHAT the intelligence agencies told Bush and Cheney. As the document describes, the agencies, when Bush asked them about it, confirmed that Saddam likely was trying to acquire and build weapons (and he was, albeit he wasn't successful due to the surprising success of the sanctions in that regard). Yet while I point to the authoritative government source on what the Intelligence was, you accuse me of just taking facts from Fox News. Either you can't read or you read selectively to see what you want. Either way, its embarrassing that you're a Columbia student if you can't even read what my sources are.

    Second, the UN never approved of U.S. military action in Iraq. (If it had, I'm sure Fox News would have had a field day). Here's another link from a non-Fox News source that confirms that: http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/iraq/un/ . It lists all the resolutions on Iraq up until 2004. The war took place between the passage of Resolution 1441 and Resolution 1546. The draft resolution from March 7, 2003, you'll notice is not numbered because it was never passed. When the U.S. and U.K. could not get it passed through the Council, it was withdrawn. If you read Resolution 1441, you'll note that it never explicitly authorizes war. And France, Germany, and most liberals/Democrats (esp. Dean and Kerry) attacked Bush for going into Iraq without UN approval. Where were you, under a rock? Only you could think that the war was "to strengthen the UN."

    And notice how, though you claim I must get my news from Fox, Hannity, or Limbaugh, I consistently provide sources to back my claims up. Its called evidence. The only source you provide, on the other hand, is a memory you describe in which " a class I took at Columbia when the professor said to the class, "I can't believe the UN approved." You go on to say "I don't remember EXACTLY what the prof was referring to." Did you ever think maybe to look it up then before you posted? Guess not. That would require too much brainpower I guess. While I'm addicted to the NY Times, CNN, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Post, and national security reports published by Congress -- and spend way too much of my time reading them -- you never even bothered to go beyond what you recall your professor saying one day in class. How ironic!

    And once again, because someone is wrong does not necessarily mean they lied. Have you ever been wrong before? Clearly, you have since you thought that the UN authorized the war when the very resolution to authorize the war had to be withdrawn when it was clear France would veto it. But did you lie? I don't think so. I think you just didn't know enough about it.

    Now imagine you are the President. Where do you go to ask about the security threat posed by a nation? To CNN? To Columbia professors? I should hope not. There is a reason that there are 15 intelligence agencies in this country that report directly to the President. And when President Bush asked them about Saddam and Weapons of Mass Production, they all came together (under the leadership of the Director of Central Intelligence) and produced a National Intelligence Estimate on the subject. According to the Senate Report on Prewar intelligence linked to in my last post, "National Intelligence Estimates (NIE) are the IC’s [Intelligence Communities] most authoritative written judgments concerning national security issues. The process by which the IC produces NIEs -including the one on Iraqi WMD -has been honed over nearly 30 years. According to the Central Intelligence Agency’s (CIA) webpage, it is designed to provide policymakers in both the executive and legislative branches with the 'best, unvarnished, and unbiased information -regardless of whether analytic judgments conform to U.S. policy.'” (Page 8 in the introduction found at http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/13jul20041400/www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/pdf/s108-301/sec1.pdf ) And, as the report described, the NIE was seriously flawed before it ever reached President Bush. To claim that Bush "deliberately lied" because he relied on what the Intelligence Community recognizes as "authoritative written judgments concerning national security issues" as a basis for his policy ludicrous. If Bush had disregarded the Intelligence Community's report, THAT would have been deliberately lying.

    A President's job is to base his judgments based off of the best information available to him at the time. The Intelligence Community's NIE should have been the best information. It was flawed, but there was no way for Bush to know that before we actually got people onto the ground and did not find WMD.

    I won't waste more time arguing the point, though, since you clearly are so self-righteous that you don't have to rely on Bipartisan congressional investigations and reports, or even on any news sources. Instead, you just take for granted what you hear professors or friends say (even if you don't remember exactly what they said), and then assert that those who disagree with you must be relying on Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, or Sean Hannity.

    In case you wonder why my tone is less civil than usual, by the way, its because you above all others should dismiss Republicans or Conservatives as people who rely only on Fox News and other conservative sources of news and who are blind to what really happens. Since you clearly don't watch any reputable news, or rely on any reputable sources, I'd suggest you not pollute this blog.

    Your ideas are welcome. But please actually back them with some material or source to show that you can actually read and cite documents.

    Oh, and Supply Side Economics says nothing about leaving spending as it is or making it worse. Please speak to Professor Mundell (who got his nobel prize for developing it) or read some textbook on economics. Supply Side is simply about cutting taxes optimal levels that generate more economic activity and result in higher tax revenues in the end. You are confusing supply side theory with Reagan's interpretation of it or Bush's own economic policies. The actual theory however does NOT include anything about spending more. Spending more to generate economic growth is Keynesian, not supply side.

    What exactly did you take at Columbia? And what was your GPA? 2.0?

    By Blogger Dennis, at 8:52 PM  

  • dennis,

    Unless I failed to make myself clear (which is possible), I did not say what you claim I said. I did not contradict what the report said, in fact it matters little what the report said (that just holds the writers of the report as responsible as it does Mr. Bushy). My comments about having to make sure that the weapons exist, and that there were enough critics denying the existence of weapons, should at least be a start on the path to calling Bush a liar. To say it is embarassing that I am a Columbia student, when you used the words, "authoritative government source" in the same phrase is a bit ironic. The government also claims inflation is no more than 2-3%. You have to be a complete moron to believe that. But this is a little off topic so I apologize for my tangent.

    There was no resolution to authorize war with Iraq (I said what I remember was a resolution that had something to do with it, not a resolution that had to do with poverty for instance. It was meant to be a descriptive phrase). However Bush stated dozens of times that he was going into Iraq to enforce UN disarmament resolutions. In effect, he wanted to do more for the UN than most memebers did. It's a brilliant long-term ploy for the UN if you think about it. So again, you accuse me of stating something that I did not state. Better luck next time.

    You're absolutely right that mentioning that class I took was not the strongest comment, but at the same time, I was hoping you could simply take it as truthful (I would probably make up a better story if I wanted to).

    You still did not explain why Bush's plans to invade Iraq were long in the making. And all those people that opposed the war on the grounds that there are no weapons... did they all just take lucky guesses?

    I don't mind the less-than-civil tone, it is the same tone I usually take. That's also why I make Limbaugh and Hannity comments (I don't actually think you spend all your time watching/listening to them).

    Your statement about supply side economics reminds me of people who claim that the Soviet Union, Communist China, and Cuba, are not actually reflections of communism. Well in that case, Reagonomics and Bushnomics are not actually supply side economics as well. You're right.

    I never said that spending should increase, I merely said that spending is either left alone or increased, as has been the case historically with the use of "supply side economics (or excuse me, Reaganomics/Bushnomics, not supply side economics)." Cutting taxes is only half the equation. Thank you for the lesson on Keynesian economics. Unfortunately I have gotten more than my fair share of that from Columbia which worships that Fabian Socialist's policy recommendations. Maybe you can enlighten me with the theories you are aware of that require cutting taxes and spending. I would be extremely impressed as these theories of economics are of great interest to me (and it would show that you know more than my econ professors do).

    I didn't provide any evidence because a) I'm too lazy to re-look up everything I have read over the last few years that reflects these views to post them and b) you won't believe what it says regardless. Thus, I am being economically efficient (and you said I had a 2 for a gpa!) by just typing out what I remember. You can call that pathetic, but it doesn't bother me one bit. I am satisfied knowing I could have regurgitated the same arguments you made if I had to take a guess as to what you would reply. My statements on the other hand, were foreign to you, and not because they have no backing (on the contrary, there is plenty I assure you) as you ignorantly think, but because you have been far more closed-minded than even I appeared to be. Why should I be the one to show you the evidence anyway? When I wanted evidence about people who think like you, I looked it up. That was my initiative. What does it say about your research if you literally were shocked at my comments? And don't respond saying that you wouldn't look for research saying that humans can flap their arms and fly just because I say so. If I am taking the time to write these annoyingly long posts, I am probably saying a little more than that humans can fly. By the way, I never take for granted what professors or my friends say. Think about it, how many people do you think have these views?

    I think your next post, if you choose to reply, should not misconstrue anything I said. It will be far more productive that way. Maybe you could also take some initiative and find similar arguments to those that I have made. Or if you want to chastise me for being lazy I will accept that too. At least it will be honest.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:58 PM  

  • "My statements on the other hand, were foreign to you, and not because they have no backing (on the contrary, there is plenty I assure you) as you ignorantly think, but because you have been far more closed-minded than even I appeared to be. Why should I be the one to show you the evidence anyway? When I wanted evidence about people who think like you, I looked it up. That was my initiative. What does it say about your research if you literally were shocked at my comments?"

    Perhaps that your comments demonstrate that you have no backing. You claim you're being economically efficient or lazy by not presenting evidence, but I'd actually be interested in seeing the evidence. The following quote from you, though, kills me:

    "Maybe you could also take some initiative and find similar arguments to those that I have made."

    That's hilariious. You expect ME to look to find your ideas. That's simply not how an argument is made. An argument is made when somebody presents a case, and then evidence for that case. You present a case, claim that plenty of evidence exists, and then suggest that I go look for it. Since I've studied these issues in detail, I'm not suddenly going to scour the internet until I find the bunch of screwballs who make up your cult. If you want to demonstrate that you're using information that's accurate, you'll have to provide evidence.

    Your comments about the Iraq UN resolution are priceless as well. You mean there was a UN resolution on Iraq at some point that said something? You deserve a medal for that insight. Now I'm REALLY impressed you knew your stuff... right.

    And how ironic that you place such a hugh burden of proof on Bush for presenting evidence when you can't even produce a link to support arguments of your own from a credible source. For Iraqi WMD, what do you expect Bush to do "to make sure that the weapons exist" before deciding if Iraq is a threat or not? Should we wait till Iraq explodes a weapon to be sure? Because, aside from that, there is no way to "make sure" what ANY nation's military is really doing. Nations go OUT OF THEIR WAY to hide what they are doing, including Iraq, which repeatedly denied weapons inspectors access to sites until they could be "sanitized" (read the Deulfer Report more about the Iraqi Intelligence Service (IIS) labs that coalition troops DID find in Iraq that we know were testing toxins and chemicals on humans but that we "sanitized" before the war began -- labs that had never been declared to the UN inspectors.)

    And quite frankly, very few people before the war who were opposed to it "on the grounds that there are no weapons." On the contrary, should you want it, I can produce for your hundreds of quotes from anti-war people who asserted just the opposite -- that Iraq might have the weapons -- but that (a) it would distract us from the war on terror and (b) that the war was illegitimate without UN approval. Only AFTER we entered and didn't find weapons did anti-war people clamour around the WMD case.

    From those who received the intelligence that was around at the time, I challenge you to find me statements by lawmakers who were receiving intelligence briefings at the time who were opposed to war on the grounds that there were no weapons.

    And if you're suggesting that President should have ignored what his (and foreign) intelligence sources are telling him in favor of private people with NO way of knowing what any country could have, then, once again, I'm glad you're not our President.

    There are good cases against the war, but your case -- and you're insistence that it was all lies -- is not one of them in my book.

    "there were enough critics denying the existence of weapons, should at least be a start on the path to calling Bush a liar."

    Who were these people? Did they have clearance to know what our intelligence agencies were reporting? Because nobody at the Security Council (not France, China, Russia, et all) or in Congress challenged the existance of illicit Iraqi arms. The discussions all were over whether to use continued inspections and whether inspectors had failed. But none claimed that there were no weapons.

    Even more, according to dictionary.com , to "lie" is defined as "A false statement deliberately presented as being true" and "lying" is defined as "To present false information with the intention of deceiving." Key to "lying," then, is HAVING THE INTENTION TO DECEIVE and KNOWING INFORMATION IS FALSE. There is NO evidence whatsoever to suggest that President Bush did not sincerely believe that the information he presented -- WHICH WAS PROVIDED AND THOROUGHLY CHECKED OVER BY THE CIA -- was true.

    If Bush believed the information he was given was true, and he conveyed that information to the American public, then he could not possibly have "lied" in the situation. Lying is an INTENTIONAL deception, and you cannot derive that Bush deliberately lied (which is actually redundant since lies HAVE to be deliberate by definition) from the fact that he was wrong. You take a logical leap there that's wider than the Grand Canyon.

    And if the United States HAD NOT had plans to invade Iraq since BEFORE Bush even came to office, it would have been derelict of its duty to defend the American people. At the time Bush took office, Iraq was the ONLY place in the world where American pilots were still being fired at and in danger.

    Furthemore, before Bush even came to office intelligence convinced President Clinton to bomb Iraq in 1998 when Saddam expelled weapons inspectors. By virtue of the fact that Clinton found the intelligence that he received so disturbing that he decided fire dozens of cruise missiles at the country, it stands to reason that Bush two years later -- being briefed on the intelligence collected during Clinton's term -- would make sure to have plans in place to deal with the country should a crisis break out again. For you to assume that PLANNING is equivalent with LYING are just ridiculous. Either you're logically deficient or you have your own agenda and just prefer not to look deeper lest it be shaken.

    Unless you provide some kind of evidence for your drivel, I won't waste anymore time refuting it.

    By Blogger Dennis, at 6:09 PM  

  • You're an insecure Bush-babbling Republican.

    It shows you have little character when you assume everything I said is simply false. It would have been one thing for you to just continue groping Bush while at the same time encouraging me to show you that evidence... but to shrug off what I said because I'm just too lazy to post the evidence is a different story.

    Showing the bigger picture to your narrow-minded brain means very little to me. If you care enough about this country, you will research this on your own. Otherwise, you can continue spitting out the same filth you spit out now (and be all the more ignorant as a result).

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:55 AM  

  • As Tolstoy puts it, "Most men can seldom accept even the simplest and most obvious truth if it would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, have proudly taught to others, and have woven thread by thread into the fabric of their lives."

    I could show you all the evidence in the world, and it would do absolutely nothing.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:16 PM  

  • You haven't even tried showing one piece of evidence. And then you assert I'm ignorance because I won't look for YOUR argument somewhere else.

    "It shows you have little character when you assume everything I said is simply false." I haven't assumed anything. I've painstakingly made my case by presenting MY evidence that YOUR case is seriously flawed. And yet YOU have not addressed MY case at all, only to assert that YOU know better and that I should look deepe into it until I reach YOUR understanding.

    The fact that you had no clue what the UN resolutions were about in your first comment speaks volumes (you claimed they approved the war; they didn't).

    I've spent hours researching these issues on my own, reading all the documents I can get them, and reaching my conclusions BASED OFF OF that research. I won't do research specifically to find sources that agree with you. The fact that NO source that I've read over these past years has at all conformed to what you have said is all the evidence I need to refer to the burden of proof, my friend, is on you if you want to challenge my beliefs.

    But clearly, you can't produce a source, because I've asked you for one in three previous posts and you've listed NONE to date just shows how "well researched" you are. And if you don't realize that you have to provide EVIDENCE to back up your ARGUMENTS then clearly you didn't learn what you should have in college. According to dictionary.com again, an argument is "A set of statements in which one follows logically as a conclusion from the others." You've given a conclusion but NO support evidence to back it up. Therefore, your argument fails.

    Ignorant, on the other hand, is defined as "Unaware or uninformed" and "lacking basic knowledge," among other things. Since you have only demonstrated beyond doubt so far that you're willing to assert some superior "bigger picture" knowledge about a subject but that you haven't even done the rudimentary research into it (like finding out what that darned professor was talking about when he discussed a UN resolution on Iraq) you're clearly ignorant by the very definition of the term.

    And I'm not "groping" Bush or in any other manner suggesting he's perfect. But I am arguing that YOU ARE WRONG to say he deliberately lied, based off the definition of those words and what Bush believed and was told by the highest level of intelligence officials at the time. Clearly, he was mistaken with his claims. But he didn't lie. And you clearly, from your explanation of what lies are, are even ignorant of what the term "lie" means (I gave the definition FROM A SOURCE) earlier.

    In short, I haven't just assumed your arguments were false. I've taken a substantial body of evidence that suggests your arguments are wrong, and I've used that to deduct your argument is wrong. And since you cannot even produce a shred of evidence in favor of your view in your posts, I find it hilarious you expect me to. If you can't find evidence for your case, that shows how little basis your case has.

    Case closed, unless you have the balls to actually defend your case with evidence. If you post again without evidence, though, I will assume you're full of shit.

    By Blogger Dennis, at 5:51 PM  

  • You assumed I was full of shit even when I told you that I'm not providing evidence BECAUSE I'M TOO LAZY.

    You lied again because I never said the UN approved of the war. What I said, is that the war was fought to strengthen the UN.

    I'm still too lazy to provide evidence. But that still does not mean that evidence does not exist. I'm not sure why you don't understand that concept.

    You can't use any amount of research to prove my argument wrong if you haven't even read about my argument (which as I stated before, I have not provided you with).

    Stop crying about the fact that I'm too lazy to provide you with evidence. Stop telling yourself that because I'm too lazy to provide you with evidence, it means that evidence does not exist.

    The only legitimate thing you have to insult me for, is that during the summer when a person has far less to do than during the year, I am still being extraordinarily lazy. That's it.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:08 PM  

  • "You assumed I was full of shit even when I told you that I'm not providing evidence BECAUSE I'M TOO LAZY."

    You're full of shit BECAUSE you're too lazy to actually look up what you're talking about. From your comments about what your professor said in class, its obvious you never even looked into it when it was happening. So here's the equation:

    Too lazy to research topic + self-righteous view of what the topic is really about without even researching it = full of shit

    Do the math.

    "You lied again because I never said the UN approved of the war. What I said, is that the war was fought to strengthen the UN."

    No, as you posted earlier, "I remember a class I took at Columbia when the professor said to the class, 'I can't believe the UN approved... was anyone actually NOT shocked?' (I must embarassingly state that I don't remember exactly what he was referring to but it had something to do with approving of Bush going to Iraq...)". You can read it above in black and white (that is, if you don't delete the post to eliminate the evidence). Accusing me of lying when your own post containing that assertion (which was the only source reference you ever tried to present -- albeit a sucky one) just shows how lazy and full of shit you are. The trademark of a liar is that he/she cannot remember what he's said before. Think about that.

    "I'm still too lazy to provide evidence. But that still does not mean that evidence does not exist. I'm not sure why you don't understand that concept."

    You're clearly not that lazy -- you've taken time to religiously check back and respond to my comments. Still, when you present a theory and that theory is questioned, it is up to you to defend it with evidence. To maintain that others should look to find evidence of your greater truth is unacceptible. I suspect the truth is that you've either never looked to start with (into the issue at all) or that you know you cannot find evidence.

    "You can't use any amount of research to prove my argument wrong if you haven't even read about my argument (which as I stated before, I have not provided you with)."

    Quite to contrary. You've written your argument out, I've refuted it with clearly documented and recognized sources. Sources are not your argument. Sources BACK UP your argument. But since you don't have sources, I digress. I'd be thrilled to read such sources should you provide them. Until then, you're still full of shit. Flush please?

    "Stop crying about the fact that I'm too lazy to provide you with evidence. Stop telling yourself that because I'm too lazy to provide you with evidence, it means that evidence does not exist."

    Well, prove me wrong. But clearly you can't. I'm not crying. I'm more concerned that someone as inept as you ever managed to get into Columbia.

    "The only legitimate thing you have to insult me for, is that during the summer when a person has far less to do than during the year, I am still being extraordinarily lazy. That's it."

    No, I can insult you for asserting a superior truth and arguing about it without a shred of evidence and with an obvious lack of prior research into the topic. In short, you're full of shit. Get the message yet?

    By Blogger Dennis, at 10:26 AM  

  • Oh yes, and one last response to the following assertion:

    "You can't use any amount of research to prove my argument wrong if you haven't even read about my argument (which as I stated before, I have not provided you with)."

    According to a prior post above, you write "Maybe you could also take some initiative and find similar arguments to those that I have made." So, in effective, you've admitted that what you made was an argument (or actually, several ones). And I've refuted it.

    Remember what I said about liars again? Well, if the shoe fits...

    By Blogger Dennis, at 10:34 AM  

  • At this point I'm just enjoying all the time I'm forcing you to waste with your responses.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:55 PM  

  • At this point, I’m enjoying that you still haven’t been able to provide evidence/sources/backing at all even after all your repeated posts.

    By Blogger Dennis, at 11:14 AM  

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